Author Topic: C Clarinet Mouthpiece  (Read 6866 times)

Offline DaveLeBlanc

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C Clarinet Mouthpiece
« on: September 12, 2012, 06:41:01 PM »
Will a Bb clarinet mouthpiece fit on a C clarinet?
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Offline Skyfacer

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RE: C Clarinet Mouthpiece
« Reply #1 on: September 12, 2012, 09:44:15 PM »
Quote from: \'DaveLeBlanc\' pid=\'50\' dateline=\'1347500461\'
Will a Bb clarinet mouthpiece fit on a C clarinet?
Hi Dave, If the C Clarinet is a modern one, such as Tom Ridenour\'s , yes , it will but the whole situation with C Clarinets is interesting as far as mouthpieces go.

On page 119 of Anthony Baines book \"Woodwind Instruments and Their History\" this is stated. :-  \"Formerly , up to 1900 in England, an orchestral clarinettist also had to have a C Clarinet, which is often written for by classical composers in movements in the keys of C and G. But today, C Clarinet parts are played on the Bb instrument ( the player reading the part a tone higher) or, in sharp keys , very often on the A. (reading a minor third higher)\"
The reasons for abandoning the C , apart from the fact that it is comparatively seldom demanded, were firstly that its tone lacks the dignified mellowness of the Bb , being in comparison hard and chirpy ; and secondly.that it needs a different mouthpiece , since its bore is over a millimetre smaller. \"

So I don\'t know what\'s changed since that was written because the Bb mouthpiece is being used on the C instrument these days even though the bore is apparently still the correct dimension for this Clarinet. According to the above, the C instrument needs a smaller mouthpiece to suit the smaller bore and hence a smaller reed.

Incidently. Anthony Baines\'s book , even though it is very dated (1967) is an excellent read , and includes detailed descriptions of the various types of woodwind mechanisms and their functions  found on old and modern Flutes/ Oboes/ Clarinets and Bassoons ect.
« Last Edit: September 12, 2012, 09:51:45 PM by Skyfacer »
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Offline DaveLeBlanc

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RE: C Clarinet Mouthpiece
« Reply #2 on: September 12, 2012, 10:19:15 PM »
Wow that\'s great, thanks for the info Barry!

Do you think a Bb mouthpiece will fit an old high pitch C clarinet?
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Offline Skyfacer

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RE: C Clarinet Mouthpiece
« Reply #3 on: September 13, 2012, 02:01:48 AM »
Quote from: \'DaveLeBlanc\' pid=\'52\' dateline=\'1347513555\'
Wow that\'s great, thanks for the info Barry!

Do you think a Bb mouthpiece will fit an old high pitch C clarinet?
Hi again Dave. No, not on an old high pitch C Clarinet. Those older instruments had their own special size mouthpiece and reeds.
Which gets me thinking. Perhaps they have increased the size of the modern C Clarinets bore to that of the Bb instrument to make it possible to fit a Bb mouthpiece into the tuning barrel of the C instrument. I need to be enlightened here. If someone has one of Tom Ridenour\'s C Clarinets it would be of interest to know the size of the bore.
« Last Edit: September 13, 2012, 07:31:37 AM by Skyfacer »
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Offline DaveLeBlanc

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RE: C Clarinet Mouthpiece
« Reply #4 on: September 13, 2012, 03:49:32 PM »
Hi,

   Today I received the HP C I got, and lo and behold, Bb mouthpiece fits!  It is a little tight, but manageable.  Sweet!
However, I\'m sure that I won\'t get the right sound out of it without the proper mouthpiece and reed
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Offline Skyfacer

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RE: C Clarinet Mouthpiece
« Reply #5 on: September 14, 2012, 12:36:47 AM »
Hi Dave , could you carefully measure the bore size at the top end of the upper joint and let me know what it is. If you haven\'t one already, get yourself one of those 150 mm stainless steel rules from your local hardware store.
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Offline DaveLeBlanc

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RE: C Clarinet Mouthpiece
« Reply #6 on: September 14, 2012, 03:56:04 PM »
Hi Barry, it looks like it is about 1.4 cm

PS, there are several pictures of the clarinet on the \"Odd/Old Clarinets\" section
« Last Edit: September 14, 2012, 03:57:30 PM by DaveLeBlanc »
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Offline Skyfacer

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RE: C Clarinet Mouthpiece
« Reply #7 on: September 14, 2012, 04:28:43 PM »
Hi Dave , 1.4 cm (14mm) sounds correct,  1m smaller than than the average Bb /A bore. So it\'s still a bit of a mystery as to how you managed to fit a Bb mouthpiece into the barrel of this C instrument. I\"ve also measured the bore size of all my Bb mouthpieces and they also come in at 15mm.
As far as getting the correct mouthpiece for it , I think it may be difficult to get one. And likewise for the reed. I know of no one who commercially makes this smaller reed.

Quote from: \'DaveLeBlanc\' pid=\'67\' dateline=\'1347663364\'

Hi Barry, it looks like it is about 1.4 cm


PS, there are several pictures of the clarinet on the \"Odd/Old Clarinets\" section

Hi again Dave, what is the brand of your C Clarinet ?

Just been looking at Phils\' review of Tom Ridenours\' C Clarinet.
The measurement of the Bore (LH Joint Top) is 14.8mm , almost the size of a 15 mm Bb bore, and the (LH Joint Bottom) is 14.3 mm , almost back to the old 14mm C bore.
So apparently there has been some modification of the bore of this modern C Clarinet to enable the Bb mouthpiece bore size (15mm) to almost match up with the upper joint bore size (14.8mm ) of the C instrument.
« Last Edit: September 14, 2012, 05:00:47 PM by Skyfacer »
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Offline DaveLeBlanc

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RE: C Clarinet Mouthpiece
« Reply #8 on: September 14, 2012, 06:36:36 PM »
Hi,

    I\'m not really sure either...  Strangely enough, the mouthpiece fit in with space to spare.

Darn... Right now the clarinet just doesn\'t sound right; I think this may be because of the too-big mouthpiece.

The one I have is a Henri Frenier Albert system HP C, I think from approx 1920 or so.  The bore on the barrel is very large: approx 25 mm.  The total width of the mouthpiece is approx 23 mm.
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Offline philpedler

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RE: C Clarinet Mouthpiece
« Reply #9 on: September 15, 2012, 01:43:25 PM »
Just a brief note because the Ridenour C clarinet was mentioned. I have the bore dimensions in my review. It plays very well in tune indeed, and with a Bb mouthpiece.

But I think you would be right about 19th century C clarinets using different mouthpieces.

Offline windydankoff

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Re: C Clarinet Mouthpiece
« Reply #10 on: October 24, 2017, 07:38:39 AM »
Iíve found with the Ridenour C and the other ebonite Chinese C clarinets that Iíve been fine-tuning for sale, that they all have the near-15mm bore on top. The bore tapers down a bit in the upper joint, just like in most modern Bb horns. The ENTIRE horn is of a ďlarge boreĒ design, to be compatible with the Bb MP. They do sound wonderful, a bit more bright and bouncy than the Bb. Some high-clarion fingerings need to be altered (simplified) for best tuning.

Iíve found the C to be a bit more fussy or selective about its mouthpieces. Of my favorite MPs (mostly old Riffault, stenciled Vito or Noblet) one is clearly finest on the C whereas my Bb is less selective, and my A clarinet even less so.
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Offline Windsong

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Re: C Clarinet Mouthpiece
« Reply #11 on: October 24, 2017, 12:18:59 PM »
A good many conventional and antique French C clarinets take Bb/A mouthpieces.  Vintage Czech/German C clarinets often take Eefer mouthpieces.  I personally feel the shorter facing and smaller chamber Eefer mouthpiece matches the warm capabilities and characteristics of the Bohemian C nicely, and have found a "full sized" Bb/A mouthpiece offers a rather bright sound.  My sample pool is rather limited, though.
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Offline Lisa

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Re: C Clarinet Mouthpiece
« Reply #12 on: October 24, 2017, 04:24:14 PM »
My no name, but most likely Czech C albert clarinet uses a smaller mouthpiece, and it doesnít sound bright, itís warm and mellow.  I enjoy playing it very much, though the intonation Is sketchy.  It changes tune dramatically as i play it.  Iím not sure if itís because itís warming up, or iím warming up, but itís very sensitive.
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Offline modernicus

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Re: C Clarinet Mouthpiece
« Reply #13 on: October 28, 2017, 06:39:19 PM »
I have antique Kohlert and Eugene Thibouville Boehm Cs with integrated barrels in LP where the sockets are too small for a standard Bb/A mouthpiece.  Other Boehm Cs from the same era I have will fit and play with standard Bb/A.
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Offline TMHeimer

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Re: C Clarinet Mouthpiece
« Reply #14 on: February 02, 2020, 08:23:44 PM »

My Buffet C (bought new in 1976) uses a Bb mouthpiece. Of course, the barrel is way smaller than it should be (proportunate to the rest of the instrument)--to make up for the larger than ideal mouthpiece(?). Perhaps this has something to do with the questionable intonation with the throat tones?
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