Harry Pedler & Co./The Pedler Co. Thread

[mechanic]

Why are there no photos of Harry Pedler or any of his kin?  I have looked for years and have never been able to find anything.  I just find it rather odd, especially in this day and age, that nothing has surfaced.

Here you go.  https://www.brasshistory.net/Pedler%20History.pdf 

[Windsong]

Here you go.  https://www.brasshistory.net/Pedler%20History.pdf

Fantastic!  I am not sure how that got past me all these years, and even more unsure how they found these, too.

Much obliged, Mechanic!

[Windsong]

Here is a WOODEN Harry Pedler & Co. Albert with the seldom seen 1st generation Diamond logo and 2nd generation keywork that I restored a year or two ago.  I just dragged it out today, and wow--what a great tone!

Despite having no damage to the clarinet at all, some real genius before me decided to spray paint it red, with a clear spray overtop!

This is the one clarinet I almost threw away--I kid you not.  I got so frustrated that I had to walk away from it several times, hence the lack of a formal write-up until now.  The works were solidly gummed up, springs were broken or "glued" to their perches with the aforementioned paint, and the wood grain was so saturated with paint that I never thought it could be saved.

It turns out that I was wrong; I am more stubborn and determined sometimes than I acknowledge, apparently. I was also wrong about how much acetone can be used on a grenadilla body without cracking it. I must have gone through a quarter can of acetone on the body and keys.  If you look carefully, you will still see traces of paint on some of the posts,  but it is a respectable restoration, anyway.  As you might imagine, it drank a lot of Almond oil after the Acetone finally dried, and it has yet to crack anywhere.

The biggest differences between 1st and 2nd generation Harry Pedler Albert system clarinets, outside of their model offerings, were the wrap-around register key and the divorced sliver key on the LJ (that became integrated in a rod stack) and the change to a straight register key in late 1923.  I honestly prefer the divorced sliver key, as it is more stable, less finicky, and easier to service.

I only regret not having larger hands to be able to play it efficiently.  (If you are 7 feet tall, a Harry Pedler Albert would probably be perfect for you.)  It plays fantasticly well:

[tadakan]

Apologies if this ends up not being relevant, but I've done my best to research and it seems like this old clarinet may be relevant here. Let me know if I should move the post or something.

I have an old clarinet that was apparently my great Uncle's. He was born around 1900, but I'm not sure when he got the clarinet. The barrel is labeled "The Peddler Premiere -Elkhart Ind" and the bell is engraved "American Challenger - made in Elkhart, Ind" but the bell tenon is broken about halfway up and it's possible that the bell is just whatever someone found to fit after it was dropped. I seem to be missing the mouthpiece that I originally used, but I did play it for about three years as a child before my parents could afford a newer clarinet (back around 1996-1999.) The case has a little metal tag nailed to the outside that says "Peddler Woodwinds" and the inside lid has a sticker applied to the fabric that says "Lyons Band Instrument Co." 17 W. LAKE ST CHICAGO - State Lake Bldg"

The body doesn't seem to have any engraving except for a serial number just above the bell tenon "R5012". But it appears that the 'R' was most likely originally a 'P' and the 5 might have been something else as well. I originally posted over in the Penzel-Mueller thread (thinking that it was a frankenstein with a P-M Bel Canto body), but Windsong posted indicating that they thought it was most likely a transitional Pedler from about 1932 based on the shape of the keys, etc.

Here's a link to a few photos of it. If anyone would like more specific photos, please let me know. https://photos.app.goo.gl/kriD1Wm1VEYnX6F56

If it would be useful to someone for parts or whatever, I'm happy to pass it on to someone who can use it for the cost of shipping from near Seattle, WA, USA.

[Windsong]

Welcome and thank you (again) for sharing this.  This is 100% a Harry Pedler.  It was probably made in 1932, give or take a year.  The keywork is undeniably Harry Pedler's before Martin began making changes. The top joint trill guides and leaf-like pinky keys are a dead giveaway.

You know, the more I look at your clarinet, Tadakan, the more I contemplate the possibility that this was manufactured prior to April of 1931.

The American "CHALLENGER" bell is also remarkable, and I have not seen another one, which for now at least, makes your clarinet unique.  (Thus far, I have only seen the Challenger name stamped into metal clarinets.)  Until I see another, I will assume you have the only one left.

That cartouche is unusual and unmistakable.  I have seen that exact oval and the font contained within before, on pre-serialized Harry Pedler clarinets, or at least made from Harry Pedler's stock, molds and machinery.  I believe however that the stencil products were part of Harry's "side hustle", or an attempt to recapture the "French-only" crowd, as La Premiere Francais clarinets are not one bit French.  It seems a bit cheesy by today's standards--at least to me.  It was a poseur move, at least, regardless the objective. SilverSorcerer shared my belief about these, and got me interested in collecting these "La Premiere Francais" Harry Pedlers in the first place.

So, this is either an original Harry, or a true "transitional" Harry Pedler, even if he never touched it personally.

As also previously mentioned, a "P" serial number on an Ebonite Pedler is not unheard of (I have seen one), but they are very uncommon.  If this clarinet were made prior to Harry Pedler's departure, and never released, it could have easily been serialized by Martin, later.

I don't typically get too excited by Harry Pedlers anymore. I have looked at hundreds and hundreds of them over the last 9 years, and I have personally purchased dozens and dozens of them, but your clarinet fascinates me.

Rocket first pointed out that Premier models got serialized by 1928.  While (I believe) his assessment covered only metal Harry Pedler "Premiere" clarinets, it may have been model wide.  (Rocket--please correct me, if I have misremembered.)  This certainly appears to be a special release of that model.

Did the factory change the "P" to an "R" for some form of differentiation?  Who and why else would anyone change a prefix? I have heard of filling in and re-stamping serial numbers, grinding them off altogether, etc., but this is different.  It's curious.  The whole thing is curious, and I am really happy you happened by with a family heirloom that you also have personal history with!

[Windsong]

And yours:

[350 Rocket]

Rocket first pointed out that Premier models got serialized by 1928.  While (I believe) his assessment covered only metal Harry Pedler "Premiere" clarinets, it may have been model wide.  (Rocket--please correct me, if I have misremembered.)  This certainly appears to be a special release of that model.

The only information I was ever able to find was that the metal Premiere was introduced in February 1928. No other material was mentioned then.

For what it's worth, I'd only seen two non-metal Premiere (with the second "e") models before: a wood one, P249, and an Ebonite, E171.

Since the prefixes aligned with the material - A, P, T, and W for wood, E for hard rubber - it's not impossible for someone to have picked up the wrong letter stamp at the factory and then have to change the "P" to the only other thing it could be turned into. It's interesting that this one doesn't have a serial number on the upper joint as well.

[350 Rocket]

I recently found "Music Instruments for Band & Orchestra", 1959-60 Edition, published by The Instrumentalist Co. The introduction states that the information is correct as of October 1959.

Pedler clarinets, flutes, piccolos, and oboes are listed in the book, which would contradict the past belief that Pedler woodwinds ended in 1956...

I just got a hold of the 1958 (first) edition of the same publication, which had heretofore been unavailable. I had hoped at least something would differ, as evidence that Pedler was indeed still making instruments then (rather than the price lists indicating merely a warehouse full of unsold inventory), but all models, prices, and features are the same. Prices not changing doesn't mean much though - a lot of clarinet makers didn't change their prices between '58 and '59.

[Windsong]

For what it's worth, I'd only seen two non-metal Premiere (with the second "e") models before: a wood one, P249, and an Ebonite, E171.

Yes;  with the 2nd "e".  Forgive the oversight.
Good postulations for an uncommon clarinet, Rocket.
It's certainly a curious one.

[350 Rocket]

Yes;  with the 2nd "e".  Forgive the oversight.
Good postulations for an uncommon clarinet, Rocket.
It's certainly a curious one.

Nothing on you; just that I've seen plenty of single-E Premiers in wood so it's probably an important distinction.

Not the best marketing strategy on Pedler's part to use both "Premiere" and "Premier" - especially since the former was aimed at school bands and the latter was seemingly a higher-end model. (I have two of the latter, 40 units apart, both 18-key/7-ring variants that certainly wouldn't've been aimed at the student market. In 1940, the Premier was priced below the Professional but above the American.)

[Windsong]

Yes indeed.  It was a terrible marketing strategy to have such a subtle name modification for a rather important distinction.

[350 Rocket]

I have discovered some very enlightening information about the later years of Pedler.

Metal clarinets remained available through at least 1955: the entry-level Model 90 at $100 and the Model 100 Custombuilt at $120. Judging by instruments I've seen, Pedler wasn't making many metal clarinets after WWII - the highest serial number I've seen is 51897, so if the 45xxx U.S. military one I've seen was WWII production, they did less than a thousand a year.

The Grenolite was introduced in 1957. The advertisement below appeared on the back cover of the April 1957 issue of Music Journal and there were no ads for it prior to that. Unfortunately, it appears Pedler never trademarked their model names, so there are no first-use dates to go on for these or any others.

Music Journal's "1957 Annual" (presumably from late in the year) has an ad that answers more questions - it announces the Medalist, Trophy, and the Pennant line, in grenadilla, Ebonite, and Grenolite. It also touts the mysterious "Perma-Pads", something I also saw in Artley flute ads. Skin pads were available "if you insist", so they must really have liked whatever this new pad material was.

The above prove conclusively that Pedler stayed in business past 1956, and give a pretty good indication on when the model changeover happened.

The October 1958 issue of Music Journal, as part of a celebration of Elkhart's centenary, included a series of articles on Elkhart instrument makers, and Pedler was included in this. There was no indication that production was winding down, so I believe the 1959 price list I referenced in a previous post does indicate that Pedler was still making instruments then.

[350 Rocket]

Advertising, however, did wind down. Despite Martin being well-advertised, Pedler no longer was. I found one last reference to Pedler in September 1960 - the Martin ad below. Doesn't quite give confidence that they were still making them, but shows Martin still cared enough to mention them.

This does, though, bolster my theory that it was Paul Richards who pulled the plug on Pedler as part of creating RMC in December 1960. I've never seen evidence that Pedlers were sold under the RMC banner. But there's an issue with that theory. Paul Richards was, by all indications, an awful businessman. There was nothing at which he couldn't throw money he didn't have, and why build a band instrument empire only to immediately toss aside the only woodwind maker? The "Music Man" marching band competition that RMC put on in 1962 included "Official Music Man" editions of an array of instruments - clarinet and flute among them. But clarinets didn't appear in Martin or Reynolds catalogs in that era. The "Official Music Man" Martin Committee III saxophones are well-known and well-regarded. But I can't find anything of the sort relating to clarinets.

[Windsong]

This is a wealth of priceless information, Rocket.  It substantiates your previous assertions, and paints a much different picture from the one we had, doesn't it?

It sounds like Paul Richards was a bull in a China shop.  I would be interested to know his background, and whether he was just a "businessman" or whether he had any real, passionate attachment to the music industry.

By 1960, I suppose Pedler's time had come.  It was a full 10 years after the company's namesake had gone on to his reward, and they held out as long as most did.  The long rolling, original wave of the American band instrument legacy was nearing its end by then.  Bundy, Selmer, Conn, and Vito still carried the torch, but little else survived.

[350 Rocket]

It definitely fills in a lot of gaps. And to think this all started from a $25 metal American I bought at a lumberyard.

Making it to 1960 was indeed a good run, considering the headwinds. Pedler operated at a loss in 1951 due to competition from lower-priced European imports - it cost 300-500% more to build a woodwind in the U.S. It's a wonder any of them made it to the '60s (and a bigger wonder that Penzel-Mueller and Pruefer made it to the '70s).

It sounds like Paul Richards was a bull in a China shop.  I would be interested to know his background, and whether he was just a "businessman" or whether he had any real, passionate attachment to the music industry.

He'd previously been general sales manager for a prominent Elkhart instrument manufacturer - one might say that he was a Conn man before he was a con man.

In his defense, he sort of had the right idea - the electric guitar was wiping out interest in wind instruments, and I think by the early '60s the writing was on the wall for the industry. But I don't think that his amalgamation made sense - Martin had the Committee trumpet that was revered in the jazz world, largely-unknown background brass, and saxophones with a great tone and build quality but an obsolete style. Reynolds had a full line of competitive-but-not-high-selling brasswinds, and Blessing was, from what I hear out of the brasswind world, at best a maker of second-rate trumpets and trombones. Too much overlap; he was building the musical equivalent of British Leyland.

The extravagant marketing campaigns contributed to Richards Music Corporation losing over 1.34 million dollars in 1962 - while management was providing the board with false figures. Chapter XI bankruptcy came in 1964.