Tenor sax mouthpiece modified for alto clarinet – It changed my life!

[windydankoff]

I have a Vito alto cl. that I play for jazz and improv. I have been almost happy with it, always wishing for a more clarinet-like tone with more uniformity throughout the range. I heard a modified tenor sax mouthpiece on an alto clarinet demonstrated by Eugene Kirton at https://www.youtube.com/@eugenekirton6548

I had a no-name plastic tenor MP in my spare collection. It had a typical cylindrical end that fit into the alto cl. socket after adapting with tape and grease. It sounded great, but flat because it was too long. So I mounted it on my lathe (using a wooden mandrel cut to the dimensions of the sax cork). I cut the MP shank about 5mm shorter until I had good tuning. Then I cut the cork groove and corked it as normal for the alto cl.

My top A, Bb and trills were very flat.  Now (4 months later) modifications to the bore have brought it all into tune.

>>>> UPDATE See web page: 
http://www.windydankoff.com/alto-clarinet-mouthpiece.html

And VIDEO demo:  https://youtu.be/2p0dbXpmfK0

The horn now plays exceptionally well. It sounds, ironically, more clarinet-like but it feels more like blowing a sax - easier! It's expressive and free-blowing. My Vito alto now has more of the character of a bass clarinet. I use a Fibracell 3.5 tenor sax reed. Think about that - It has the same range as a tenor sax, so why shouldn't it have the same length of reed?

To my amazement, the intonation is BETTER than my alto cl. mouthpieces, two vintage Vito France and a J&D Hite. It is the only MP I have that lets me start and articulate the low and mid clarion notes.

Conclusion:  I will never go back to a conventional MP!  BTW, it will still fit a tenor sax, just looks ridiculous. I'm having fun doing my Rubank exercises on this alto. It's less fatiguing to my chops, and easy on the ears. It also keeps me in practice for the bass cl. It plays a wicked blues.

[Windsong]

That's awesome, Windy.  What a great bit of experimentation and fine calibration you always do.  I doff my hat to you for your pioneering sensibilities and fearlessness.  I never cease to be amazed by the hurdles you clear. 
Very nice.

[philpedler]

Way to go, Windy!
Congratulations!
Phil

[windydankoff]

I get peculiar thrills by making things do what they were not intended to do, and getting a superior result. As a kid, I did that in the amateur radio hobby. I made my living doing some of that in the early years of off-grid solar power and solar water pumping.

Possibilities for other clarinets? No, luck has its limits. Exploring this for soprano or Bass clarinet, I saw that the bore of the alto sax or bari sax MP (respectively) are FAR from appropriate. The bore match for tenor sax MP to alto clar. is a unique and lucky coincidence.

[modernicus]

Very impressive adaptation - I totally get your philosophy 8)

[windydankoff]

My first attempt (Proto 1: described above) used a cheap old student piece that has a big round smooth chamber (vintage classical).

My Proto 2 involved a Rico Graftonite C5 tenor MP that a friend gave me. For sax, it is a very good piece with a medium bright tone. Result - strangely bright with a chaotic spray of harmonics. Intonation was good however, and that gives me further encouragement. For Proto 3, I will return to the round classic chamber.

Two weeks later:  The more I play, the more I love Proto 1. It sounds like dark chocolate, smooth over the break with a gutsy transition a bit like a baritone sax, then good up to altissimo G#. Articulation problems show up on low clarion requiring some jaw work, but that seems chronic to the horn (just like a bass cl. with single register vent). For legato passages it's fine, but I'll try to improve it.

Photos:
1. Proto 2 a prototype on the lathe, first shortened, now starting the cork groove.
2. Proto 1 finished

[Windsong]

"sounds like dark chocolate, smooth over the break with a gutsy transition a bit like a baritone sax"

Wow, man!  That's the stuff!

[windydankoff]

I am producing more of these modified MPs based on Prototype 1, with its classical rounded chamber. I found a source for this acrylic MP. I developed a reamer to enlarge the upper bore, improving the clarion to sound more clarinet-like. I have now produced a series of 8 prototypes with 3 playing perfectly. The purpose was to "tune the tool" to tune the bore, and also to practice hand-finishing the facing for a better reed seal. All the while, I'm learning the effects of these variables.

I had to give it the only possible name:  BIGMouthPiece

One of our illustrious members is the first to receive one (for his Pedler alto). He sent me his initial reaction:
" I LOVE THIS MOUTHPIECE setup!  ... You've taken a rather boring horn and given it a sonorous, gutsy personality.  The alto has never been regarded as anything but a filler horn, and now it can take center stage.  ...  Frankly, it's a whole new instrument--and a better one, at that. "  – Windsong

Thanks to ClarinetPages for all your support over the past 8 years!

[Windsong]

Windy--what you have done to provide for fuller, and quite frankly-better sound and projection without sacrificing intonation is extremely clever.  This is a really fun instrument with brand new relevance.

I am excited to see how my technique improves and expands, as a result of being exposed to this hidden 'realm' you've discovered.

[Windsong]

Nice job, Windy!

[Eugene]

So I have been playing The Big Mouth alto piece off and on but the last 2 days are amazing. I can fly around top to bottom on my alto easily with no stuffiness and no resistance like the old mpc I had. The is gonna revolutionize alto playing and bring back the alto like never before. I plan to post a vid on my youtube channel Woodwind Wizard once I have this piece by Astor Piazzolla down to an acceptable level .So in the next week or two be ready, Big  shout out to WINDY

[windydankoff]

BIGMouthPiece WEB PAGE:
https://www.windydankoff.com/alto-clarinet-mouthpiece.html

DEMONSTRATION VIDEO:
https://youtu.be/2p0dbXpmfK0
I show the ease and clarity of the most difficult intervals going over the break, plus intonation and quality in the full chromatic range.

[Eugene]

I started many years ago playing clarinet altosax and flute the on to tenorsax.I had a good grasp on emboucher and diaphram support, so when I started playing alto clarinet I could not figure out why it was so hard yo blow even with a Clark Fobes mpc.It was like night and day from clarinet or sax so stuffy resistive.I use to get sore abs from blowing so hard.I knew there had to be a reason,I got a good tone out of it but it was a struggle.I read all the past info on alto clarinet and everyone agreed it was the nature of the beast.Why why I started thinking what could change on the alto to make it more easy to blow,a mouthpiece with bigger chamber by chance I had both tenor and alto out and was playing a caravan on tenor and noticed how close the shank came to fitting in my alto socket and so it started.By hand I shortened it a quarter inch and formed a round roll of sand paper around the shank and sanded till it fit .I used a paper sleeve as cork.Once I set it up I customized the sax reed by sanding both sides till it blew comfortably.I was amazed and tested on tuner ,wasn't perfect but acceptable to play except up high,but for concert band was great
 

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[windydankoff]

Thanks Gene for the story of your discovery.

There are now 16 of mine out in the wild. I have finalized the design and built a system to turn the tenon efficiently. Photo shows the tenon cutter "BIGMouth Vortex". The piece is held in a friction chuck made of wood, with a tapered interior and an ejector hole for popping it out afterward. After that comes bore reaming, altissimo undercut, and the Noise Filter texture.

https://www.windydankoff.com/alto-clarinet-mouthpiece.html

[Windsong]

I am very much still in love with this mouthpiece.  It has truly unhindered the horn, and brought a beautiful sound to light. The growl through the break and mid-Clarion is sensational, boasting sultriness directly on par with a tenor sax.