Author Topic: The "Harry"  (Read 9779 times)

Offline Windsong

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The "Harry"
« on: December 19, 2016, 05:20:04 PM »
I have just acquired a phantom clarinet--a 7 ring "Harry", made presumably between 1919-1930--not a 1930s-on "The Pedler" branded Martin.  I bought it on a whim, as I had never seen or heard of a 7 ring from the aforementioned.
Does anyone here have information regarding a 7 ring HR Harry Pedler?
There seems to be no information, whatsoever, in cyberspace to tap into.
« Last Edit: December 20, 2016, 11:34:55 AM by Windsong »
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Offline DaveLeBlanc

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Re: The "Harry"
« Reply #1 on: December 19, 2016, 08:30:21 PM »
Only Harry I've ever heard of is the Pedler.  It's got to be American since no European makers would have gone by "Harry".  Can you tell from the keys what maker it may be related to?  Perhaps it's a stencil?
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Offline Windsong

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Re: The "Harry"
« Reply #2 on: December 20, 2016, 03:50:18 AM »
Sorry, Dave.  My post was confusing.  I was attempting to make a play on the latter company's branding of "The Pedler" by calling it  The "Harry".
It hasn't arrived yet, but it's reportedly imprinted Harry Pedler and Co.


« Last Edit: December 20, 2016, 11:37:04 AM by Windsong »
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Offline Airflyte

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Re: The "Harry"
« Reply #3 on: December 20, 2016, 06:29:33 PM »
Sorry, Dave.  My post was confusing.  I was attempting to make a play on the latter company's branding of "The Pedler" by calling it  The "Harry".
It hasn't arrived yet, but it's reportedly imprinted Harry Pedler and Co.

Sounds like a true pre-Martin Harry horn (that sounds odd) -  anyway, I'm looking forward to your assessment of the instrument!
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Offline Windsong

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Re: The "Harry"
« Reply #4 on: December 22, 2016, 01:52:08 PM »
With the clarinet having arrived this AM, and upon having the opportunity to inspect it, I must say I am very pleased.  It IS a 7 ring, 18 key Harry Pedler, pre-serial number LP Bb.

It is hard rubber, and the body appears to be virtually flawless.  Interestingly, there is a circumfrential weld mark on the lower joint.  It appears not to be a repair, as it does not intrude into the bore at all.  As interestingly, there is an authentic 1941-1945 U.S. Army 3rd Armored Division (AKA "Spearhead") applique on the original case.  The 3rd was one of the most active heavy armor divisions of WWII, and participated in most of the major battles in France. As this clarinet was presumably built 11-22 years before the 3rd's involvement in the war, there may be no affiliation, whatsoever, but it does cause me to wonder whether it saw military service. 

The keywork is all there, blemish free and unmangled (albeit tarnished), the screws that hold the keys in place are generally unmolested, and the pads look mostly original.  Keywork is unlike anything I have ever seen.  It looks solid, but fragile (or "dainty"), if that makes any sense.  Believe it or not, it plays, top to bottom, but suffers from leaks, so a heavy hand was required for some notes.  I did get every note to register, and it has a surprisingly beautiful, dark tone in the Chalumeau register.

It's dirty, and will need an entire disassembly and rebuild, but the keys shine under the grime like nickel and appear unplated, exhibit little wear, and it's all here.  With this being hard rubber,  I can soak the stripped body in lukewarm water and mild detergant without doing any damage, as I do resonite clarinets, and HR mps.

Now, to determine what I really have.

Well-that's the preliminary report.  I'll post up photos as soon as I have a chance to do a decent once-over spitshine.  I wasn't looking for another project, as I'm currently involved in two disassembled woodwinds, but the iron was hot, and I'm glad I struck.
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Offline Airflyte

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Re: The "Harry"
« Reply #5 on: December 22, 2016, 06:29:51 PM »
Could the weld mark possibly be marks from a marching lyre ???

Sounds like an interesting "horn".
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Offline Windsong

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Re: The "Harry"
« Reply #6 on: December 23, 2016, 12:25:22 PM »
Good thought, and initially, I assumed it was a scratch, but it's in a spot where keywork resides, so nothing could have been clamped around the clarinet at that location.  It could be an excellent surgical repair, where perhaps the tenon socket snapped (a likely scenario in a warzone), and someone simply cut out the offending area, and machined and counter-sunk a donor socket, which is why there is no repair indication on the inside of the bore, but this scenario is improbable.  I simply tend to think that at time of manufacture, they did not want to waste a good, almost long enough piece of hard rubber, so they spliced on another small section, prior to machining, but that idea seems odd to me, as well.
 :o
If I get it up and running, I may say farewell to my resonite clarinets, as HR is reportedly even more thermally stable.
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Offline DaveLeBlanc

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Re: The "Harry"
« Reply #7 on: December 23, 2016, 02:40:04 PM »
I've seen that on a hard rubber oboe, once.  I figured it was a repair, but if it was a repair it was done pretty darn well.
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Offline modernicus

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Re: The "Harry"
« Reply #8 on: December 24, 2016, 09:57:11 AM »
If that's the one that I saw, I was tempted-till you bought it!   It also has no crow's foot, correct? Just extra arms w/ adjusting screws.... Silversorcerer on here has a wood/silver plated keys version if so.  Glad it looks to be in good condition.  I've found that my old very old wooden instruments are needing tone hole work to seal up properly, but the metal/hard rubber seem to give very few problems- the pads seal up like butter first try, and no cracks.  I'm thinking these hard rubber are way to go for the best antique players.  I passed on an old Kohlert HR years ago, have been looking for one again, though the Valettes that Phil reviewed with the excellent intonation are tempting as well.
« Last Edit: December 24, 2016, 10:00:39 AM by modernicus »
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Offline Windsong

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Re: The "Harry"
« Reply #9 on: December 25, 2016, 01:27:43 PM »
Very good eye, Modernicus.  That's the one.  Because I had actually never seen a Boehm without a crow's foot (or at least hadn't paid attemtion if I did), I thought this an unusual one.  The double arm achieves the same result-just with different, and dare I say "better" or at least more sophisticated means, as it has an adjustment screw, for precise regulation.
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Offline modernicus

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Re: The "Harry"
« Reply #10 on: December 26, 2016, 11:37:50 AM »
Some Harry Pedler metals as well as H.N. White metal clarinets used this arm/ no crow's foot arrangement as well back then.  I think silver mentioned that Peter Eaton has used it in more recent times.  Looks like a good idea.
« Last Edit: December 26, 2016, 11:52:08 AM by modernicus »
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Offline Windsong

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Re: The "Harry"
« Reply #11 on: December 31, 2016, 05:11:33 AM »
It certainly makes sense to me.  It requires more precise and extensive machining in the manufacturing process, but the result enables the handy player (and certainly the mechanic) to make easier and more accurate adjustments on the fly without the need to bend keys, and much simplier key angle regulations to the most finicky of Boehms.  I've fought with the crowsfoot cluster far more than with any other keys, as I imagine we all have.  
I wonder why it never caught on in the mainstream, and can only imagine it was due either to patent rights or a desire not to break from the standard of the time.

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Offline Airflyte

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Re: The "Harry"
« Reply #12 on: February 06, 2017, 12:50:56 PM »
Windsong, any follow-up on this one? Just wondering . . .
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Offline Windsong

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Re: The "Harry"
« Reply #13 on: February 22, 2017, 05:55:23 PM »
Lisa has motivated me to get off my duff and post pics of my dirty green Harry Pedler:
  :o
Check out that unusual top joint sliver key with the little pad cup beneath it.  I am going to have to look more into this...
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Offline Lisa

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Re: The "Harry"
« Reply #14 on: February 22, 2017, 07:13:48 PM »
Nice!  It does look a lot like mine, though mine is just "the Pedler" making mine a Martin stencil, not an actual "harry" like yours is.
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