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Author Topic: Do jazz players favour double lip?  (Read 806 times)

Offline LarryS

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Do jazz players favour double lip?
« on: May 30, 2022, 02:38:56 PM »
I notice that classical players hold the instrument almost vertical, because of the way a reed instrument works. But jazz players tend to be portrayed holding it more horizontal. But when I do this the sound is weaker because the reed is being blown at a different angle due to the classic clarinet embouchure.
I know many players favour the double lip embouchure and this allows the player to hold the instrument higher. So is that where it comes from, the new orleans jazz era?
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Offline kehammel

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Re: Do jazz players favour double lip?
« Reply #1 on: May 31, 2022, 07:12:09 AM »
Double lip embouchure is the way the clarinet was played when it was invented in the 1700s. It was also common to play with the mouthpiece rotated so the reed was on top, for which a single lip embouchure is impossible. Playing with the reed on top was mostly abandoned in the 1800s, although some Italian players continued doing it until the early 1900s. Also in the 1800s, the German player Klose advocated using a single lip embouchure instead of double lip, and most players worldwide gradually switched to it. A summary of the history can be found here:

https://clarinetcorner.wordpress.com/2013/05/05/mouthpiece-puzzle/

Some classical players still use double lip, and you can find videos online advocating it- for example, the maker Tom Ridenour likes it and refers to it as French embouchure.

I don't know what proportion of jazz players use double lip. I do use it myself and find single lip awkward.


Offline delb0y

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Re: Do jazz players favour double lip?
« Reply #2 on: May 31, 2022, 09:41:50 AM »
I'm sure Benny Goodman changed to double lip embouchure at some point. I use single, and I'm too old to change, but I do find that if I experiment with my clarinet angle as I play, my best tone is at an angle of around 45 degrees, rather than more vertical. Not necessarily the most comfortable angle for my hands and arms, but my lips don't mind.

Derek

Offline super20dan

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Re: Do jazz players favour double lip?
« Reply #3 on: June 02, 2022, 06:13:22 PM »
info says benny changed to double lip in the early 50,s  tho i dont see why.

Offline windydankoff

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Re: Do jazz players favour double lip?
« Reply #4 on: June 03, 2022, 10:17:28 AM »
I believe that embouchure and angle variations must all be tuned to the individual, as each of us has distinctly different anatomy and muscle behavior. It's helpful to be aware of all these variations as a map of the territory to explore. Then, let your ear (and endurance) be your guide.
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Offline LarryS

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Re: Do jazz players favour double lip?
« Reply #5 on: June 06, 2022, 06:30:52 AM »
Quote from: kehammel

Some classical players still use double lip, and you can find videos online advocating it- for example, the maker Tom Ridenour likes it and refers to it as French embouchure.

I don't know what proportion of jazz players use double lip. I do use it myself and find single lip awkward.
I've watched that video before, I didn't realise he was playing with the reed on top! I thought double lip was still with the reed in the normal position, on the bottom.
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Offline kehammel

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Re: Do jazz players favour double lip?
« Reply #6 on: June 06, 2022, 11:32:00 AM »
He's playing with the reed on the bottom. I only mentioned playing with it on top because it shows that double lip must have come before single lip. Possibly some current players of baroque clarinet or chalumeau might try having the reed on top, but I haven't heard of any examples so far.

Offline LarryS

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Re: Do jazz players favour double lip?
« Reply #7 on: June 06, 2022, 11:34:27 AM »
. Possibly some current players of baroque clarinet or chalumeau might try having the reed on top, but I haven't heard of any examples so far.
Ah yes HIP players probably would do that.
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